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Ad storytelling and the "so what?" test — what founders and Barry Hott say makes ads scale

From Barry Hott's founders' roundtable (Flakes, HelloTushy, The Perfect Jean, Dara Denney) — the "so what?" test (the moment a viewer would say "so what" is where you lose them, usually in second one), specific vs vague comment-reply overlays, storytelling over formats, writing skill and Toastmasters, studying infomercials/QVC, long ads (a 2:15 founder round-table ad spent ~$140K in 7 days), and how to train teams to spot why content is compelling.

Updated 2026-10-24·1 source·ad-creativestorytellinghooksscriptsfounder-adslong-form

Ad storytelling and the “so what?” test

TL;DR

  • Run a “so what?” test on every cut. Ovadia’s version has everyone raise a hand when they get bored. Barry’s sharper version asks where a viewer would think “so what, this isn’t for me”. In ~90–99% of ads that happens in the first second.1
  • The first moment matters most. Barry checks it first whenever a concept fails. Front-load the problem.2
  • Be specific. A TikTok-reply overlay reading “How do you install it?” is too vague. “Bidets must be impossible to install” names the doubt and telegraphs the ad.3
  • An ad isn’t analytics, a format or a script. It is you talking to one person behind a phone to change their behaviour.4
  • Long ads can win. Barry’s unicorn was a ~2:15 phone-shot founder round-table that spent $130–140K in 7 days in every ad set and landing page it was put in, and lifted the rest of the account.56

Details

Storytelling is the hard-to-copy part. A Flakes ad scaled partly because commenters thought the founder was NFL quarterback Baker Mayfield (“nice Baker”). Celebrity look-alikes that Dara tested (a Gwyneth Paltrow double) didn’t scale, because the story, not the look-alike, carries the ad.78 A founder on the panel warned that copy-paste Figma ad templates may work for a brand new brand, but for a 3- or 5-year-old brand they “definitely” won’t, so tell your own story.9

Products that need explaining. The roundtable brands (dandruff shampoo, bidets, stretch jeans) can’t sell from a product image or a DPA the way a huge catalogue can. They must teach and solve a problem.10 Justin Allen’s founder story (he lived in bidet-using Japan and Korea) is the kind Dara said would make her buy. One of Barry’s best Tushy ads is a similar travel story about bidets at Japanese truck stops. He shot it himself, unpolished, on his four-minute walk to work.11

Skills to build (Ovadia Lebaton, The Perfect Jean). Everyone on his team must write scripts. He circulates a podcast on the art of storytelling and suggests Toastmasters to learn to make boring things (jeans) compelling.12

Study infomercials and QVC. Ronco, ShamWow and QVC/HSN hosts are “incredible storytelling”: problem, demo, “but wait, there’s more”. Viewers aren’t there to shop, yet the hosts hold attention for minutes. Barry: “that’s what we should be studying.”1314 Dara’s reminder: people love to buy, they just don’t want to feel duped, and Meta is already showing them what they’re inclined to buy.15

Training the eye.

  • Dara’s exercise: each team member brings a piece of content they love (often Gen Z creators). The group dissects why it held them. One example: an influencer’s $15K/month apartment pulled viewers in through price and voyeurism, which maps to using numbers and statistics in ads.16
  • Barry: make topic-specific Instagram accounts (cars, men’s health, home) and study what the feed serves organically. Your personal feed isn’t your customer’s.17

Seasonality still matters. In back-to-school months parents buy kids’ clothes “no matter what”. You still need good ads, but it’s very hard to sell something people don’t want.18

Disagreements / caveats

See also

Footnotes

  1. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 30:09 — Ovadia Lebaton, Barry Hott ↩

  2. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 34:20 — Barry Hott ↩

  3. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 34:20 — Barry Hott ↩

  4. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 29:22 — Ovadia Lebaton ↩

  5. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 1:01:26 — Barry Hott ↩

  6. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 1:03:43 — Barry Hott ↩ ↩2

  7. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 25:27 — Jason Goode ↩

  8. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 27:52 — Dara Denney ↩

  9. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 38:25 — roundtable founder (speaker unclear in transcript) ↩

  10. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 39:13 — Barry Hott ↩

  11. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 39:58 — Dara Denney, Justin Allen, Barry Hott ↩

  12. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 36:07 — Ovadia Lebaton ↩

  13. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 1:07:42 — Ovadia Lebaton ↩

  14. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 1:10:00 — Barry Hott ↩

  15. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 1:11:36 — Dara Denney ↩

  16. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 41:36 — Dara Denney ↩

  17. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 43:11 — Barry Hott ↩

  18. I spoke to 3 Founders about MAKING ADS (feat. Dara Denney) @ 1:04:30 — Ovadia Lebaton ↩